How to detect MCoder II games?

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marenja
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Re: How to detect MCoder II games?

Post by marenja »

druellan wrote: Wed Jan 17, 2024 10:49 am I can give you access to the spreadsheet if you want to take a look an add notes. The big issue we have is really Aquasquad, that is marked in the ZXDB as MCoder II, but I can't confirm it.
I don't think i can do a lot this time as my method of comparing takes significant time. But i will look into Aquasquad and Tank Command during weekend to see if i can do any conclusion about these titles.

My suggestion is to add a column for sequence line numbering. It will help to restore `timeline' if you sort using any other column and need to add any other new game records a year later. A column with `notes' now contains mainly compiler names with rare real comments like

Code: Select all

Andy Remic is confirmed using MCoder II
From the Shaw brothers, they often use MCoder II
Length =  bytes     Run: enter RAND USR
I think it can be renamed to `compiler' for ease of sorting by compiler name. And all real comments can be moved to other column.
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druellan
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Re: How to detect MCoder II games?

Post by druellan »

marenja wrote: Fri Jan 19, 2024 10:29 am I don't think i can do a lot this time as my method of comparing takes significant time.
But i will look into Aquasquad and Tank Command during weekend to see if i can do any conclusion about these titles.
Yeah, exactly, don't worry about the other titles, there is no way we can manually check all the titles in the Spectrum collection, but for sure we are going to have a few ones that worth to check and see if we can uncover something. Thanks!
My suggestion is to add a column for sequence line numbering. It will help to restore `timeline' if you sort using any other column and need to add any other new game records a year later. A column with `notes' now contains mainly compiler names with rare real comments like
Done! It was not my intention to flag the compiler type, just to note everything I've found in the title that might or might not confirm it is a compiled code. But this way is more clear for others to take a look and contribute.
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druellan
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Re: How to detect MCoder II games?

Post by druellan »

Hi @Einar Saukas I've found more titles compiled by Super Compilatore - Softwell, I added them to the spreadsheet (near the end), just in case you are also doing the tagging once you add that particular compiler.

Also, I found another local version of the MCoder II, this time from Hungary.

Code: Select all

 1984. PI-VOTY B. Compiler     Compiled OK   Program Length =  bytes   To run enter RAND USR 
But this one seems NOT to be localized, just the copyright changed.

Two games make use of this one:
Tobias Kalandjai - https://spectrumcomputing.co.uk/entry/17080
Vadaszat - https://spectrumcomputing.co.uk/entry/17081
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Re: How to detect MCoder II games?

Post by marenja »

Both games contain mcoder2 library but copyrights are removed. I have compared snapshots of games with mcoder2 snapshot.
Tank Command overwrites compiler messages and copyright with game help text. Probably it is not just obfuscation but a trivial out of memory problem.
Aquasquad overwrites copyright with some binary data.
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Re: How to detect MCoder II games?

Post by druellan »

marenja wrote: Sat Jan 20, 2024 1:37 pm Aquasquad overwrites copyright with some binary data.
Thanks, probably that's why I can't find the hex I'm using on the search, that is extracted from the binary immediately below the copyright text.
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Re: How to detect MCoder II games?

Post by goodboy »

I managed to find a compiler in games from Tony Barber.
https://spectrumcomputing.co.uk/list?label_id=14709
archon 33393
cauldron 24823
panzadrome 24823
think 25223
xarq 24735
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druellan
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Re: How to detect MCoder II games?

Post by druellan »

goodboy wrote: Mon May 20, 2024 1:05 pm I managed to find a compiler in games from Tony Barber.
https://spectrumcomputing.co.uk/list?label_id=14709
archon 33393
cauldron 24823
panzadrome 24823
think 25223
xarq 24735
Oh, Cauldron, no less. Is this an unknown compiler?
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goodboy
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Re: How to detect MCoder II games?

Post by goodboy »

I could not identify him.
and it uses some procedures from ROM.
and he is in
dandy 26174
Mr. Weems and the She Vampires 26174
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Re: How to detect MCoder II games?

Post by goodboy »

i trying find some signatures ....
One on One 33223
Realm of Impossibility 34223
twice race 35674 ( on the sideB of Twice Shy )
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Re: How to detect MCoder II games?

Post by worcestersource »

Hang on? Cauldron and Panzadrome are compiled basic?
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druellan
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Re: How to detect MCoder II games?

Post by druellan »

goodboy wrote: Mon May 20, 2024 3:32 pm i trying find some signatures ....
One on One 33223
Realm of Impossibility 34223
twice race 35674 ( on the sideB of Twice Shy )
The interesting thing is that there are some coincidences between publishers and coders, specially Tony Barber, that worked on all the companies that make use of this supposed compiler, even when he is not the author of the titles.

Also, these titles have a similar code:
Bull Run https://spectrumcomputing.co.uk/entry/7 ... m/Bull_Run
Byte Bitten: https://spectrumcomputing.co.uk/entry/7 ... yte_Bitten
Video Hell: https://spectrumcomputing.co.uk/entry/1 ... Video_Hell
Killer Knight: https://spectrumcomputing.co.uk/entry/2 ... ler_Knight
Loony Zoo: https://spectrumcomputing.co.uk/entry/2 ... /Loony_Zoo
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druellan
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Re: How to detect MCoder II games?

Post by druellan »

From https://classicadventurer.co.uk/pdf/09-A4.pdf

Trevor Toms from Phipps Associates and RamJam Corporation:
Two extremely good contributors of adventure games were Mike Farley (The Knight’s Quest, Greedy Gulch) and Tony Barber (Valkyrie 17). Tony was also a dab hand at arcade-style games, but as these were written in BASIC so did not perform well enough for publication. So I set about writing a BASIC compiler [a tool to convert BASIC commands into fast machine code] for them which allowed all Tony’s arcade games to run smoothly and effectively and they were sold on cassette.
Tony Barber joined Ramjam, and George, Simon and Tony began work on Panzadrome, our first arcade-style game. I merged in the grid graphics code from the adventure engine into the BASIC compiler, and introduced sprite management routines using REM statements to provide the control mechanism. This made it easier for Tony to create the game logic yet gave the performance we needed for arcade games.
Seems that this was not a commercial software but an in-house tool for Phipps Associates and RamJam Corporation, also used by Tony Barber.
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